Hi #reliabilitygang !
Welcome to a brand new series called the Reliability Roadmap Series, this series focusses on the stages of the roadmap step by step to escape the reactive maintenance cycle.
The first episode is the most important part of any journey, its about getting the buy in from all parties involved that allows the next steps to be effective. This is why the culture is so important as it is the basis of how our mindset and perception needs to change to adopt new techniques that may be very different to what has been done in the past.
This week's candid conversation wades into the intricate dance of change management and communication. We trade insights on how to gradually introduce the concept of reliability to staff, championing incremental change to ensure a solid foundation of support. Dive into our personal takeaways from a DISC workshop, where we learned the art of tailoring dialogue to resonate with every unique communication style—because, at the end of the day, how you convey change can be just as pivotal as the change itself.
We wrap up by highlighting the pivotal role of training and support in cultivating a rock-solid reliability foundation within organisations. Every organization needs its champions, and we stress the value of in-house heroes who can steer the ship away from the stormy seas of reactive maintenance. With a nod to the dedicated reliability engineers and the clear-cut roles they play, we share how to create a robust framework for impactful change. So, as we gear up for our next stage—strategy—we invite you to join us in not just learning but living reliability culture. Here's to a week of taking strides in the right direction!
Hi #reliabilitygang !
Welcome to a brand new series called the Reliability Roadmap Series, this series focusses on the stages of the roadmap step by step to escape the reactive maintenance cycle.
The first episode is the most important part of any journey, its about getting the buy in from all parties involved that allows the next steps to be effective. This is why the culture is so important as it is the basis of how our mindset and perception needs to change to adopt new techniques that may be very different to what has been done in the past.
This week's candid conversation wades into the intricate dance of change management and communication. We trade insights on how to gradually introduce the concept of reliability to staff, championing incremental change to ensure a solid foundation of support. Dive into our personal takeaways from a DISC workshop, where we learned the art of tailoring dialogue to resonate with every unique communication style—because, at the end of the day, how you convey change can be just as pivotal as the change itself.
We wrap up by highlighting the pivotal role of training and support in cultivating a rock-solid reliability foundation within organisations. Every organization needs its champions, and we stress the value of in-house heroes who can steer the ship away from the stormy seas of reactive maintenance. With a nod to the dedicated reliability engineers and the clear-cut roles they play, we share how to create a robust framework for impactful change. So, as we gear up for our next stage—strategy—we invite you to join us in not just learning but living reliability culture. Here's to a week of taking strides in the right direction!
Hello and welcome back to another episode of the Reliability Gang Podcast. Hope everyone's keeping well. I'm here with my right hand, man Will Crane. Hello everyone, how are we keeping?
Speaker 2:Very, very well, thank you.
Speaker 1:Thank you everyone that's been tuning in recently. Last week, I think we had 80 downloads. Nice, nice, we're rounding the numbers up now, man, I think this is great, that we're. Do you know what is really good? Yeah and I like what in a week, like in a week.
Speaker 2:It's pretty good. It's amazing. I keep getting the emails every now and then and it's like this podcast has been going for three weeks and we're getting to 100, 150 on some of them.
Speaker 1:But do you know? What is nice, though, is it accumulation. So even after a few weeks, people are obviously Tune in. Yeah, tune them back in, but I mean, I think ever since we kind of started talking about reliability a little bit more, in a kind of centered way, we've actually started to get more out of these podcasts, and then we have an idea of like well, we need to talk about this, we need to talk about that, and one thing that I did want to talk about today was the roadmap, but instead of condensing the whole roadmap into half an hour, we'll had an idea of like well, we do need to Do it separately.
Speaker 2:Do it separately.
Speaker 1:Do it in stages. So obviously Will is he loves the reliability. He kind of you know the whole structure around it and he really does dissect in each part. And obviously every single company that we work with we understand they're at different stages, so this is why I think this series is going to be really good. So I don't know what we're going to call it. We're going to call this I don't know like when I get the idea this is off the cuff. We've just decided this now, so we will brand this in a way to be able to create this. But today we're going to be talking about the first stage. And what is the first stage? Will, when it comes down to this reliability kind of journey and process.
Speaker 2:So I'll suppose I'll give a bit of kind of background as to where this kind of roadmap comes from. So this is a reliability roadmap that Mobius Institute has set out as part of their asset reliability practitioner kind of course that you can take and they it's kind of a stage by stage process of different elements that all feed into moving towards a reliability focus in the business. The first primary stage of that is looking at reliability culture and there's, as well as the ARP course Mobius do another one called the maintenance reliability transformation course which looks at really focusing more on breaking out of reactive Of that cycle yeah.
Speaker 2:So that's kind of separate but they all in a link. But within this reliability culture part, within stage one, it's all about looking at right, getting the team together Right. So there's lots of different parts within that. So setting the vision, building a steering group, getting a team together, looking at training and management and buying them. We'll go through all these in a bit more detail, looking at change, management and all of that kind of bit. And then the MRT stuff kind of breaks that down into a little bit more kind of simpler kind of framework as such, of course more Because it's more strategic engineering based, technical MRT, more kind of like how do we actually do it?
Speaker 1:How do you?
Speaker 2:actually implement it. Yeah, so MRT covers it in a bit more breakdown. So the first kind of bit that they look at within that reliability culture stage is operations, maintenance and production, and they put it into a bracket of cooperation.
Speaker 1:Yeah, how do you glue together these working parts that allow your business to be able to be moving all in the right, in the same direction in terms of getting to that reliability goal? And I think this is why this is the hardest bit, because it's like a lot of companies that we've found try to implement all of the tangible things that you can do, create calories and all these other things that can be done. You know asset list for me because NRCAs but until kind of everyone really is working on the same page and understands where is going and why is going that way and has that cohesion, then a lot of them things can't be as effective as they need to be. It's a bit like kind of doing the condition based maintenance across your whole plant. I mean, some parts of that are going to be valuable, but until you really focus and harness it into the right places where it needs to be, the value doesn't kind of then really kind of get to the place where you need it to be. So when we talk about kind of the culture and actually trying to glue together different departments, we've found that it's a bit For me personally, in my experience, it's a bit of a mixture.
Speaker 1:I've had some companies that are really I mean now it's actually quite interesting, though, because I have actually spoke to a couple of companies recently where they came from operations and they're actually now doing the engineering management role, and because they know and understand the constraints from both sides, it's really actually valuable for them to be in that position.
Speaker 1:Do you know what I mean?
Speaker 1:And I think that they're ones that I think really now kind of what we do speak about this reliability framework and roadmap, they're so excited for it because I think they really combine into it, whereas I think some companies have been so segregated for so long and you can see like how that has happened over a long period of time, and because they're ingrained in that almost automatic kind of not conditioning, but because it's been like that for so long, breaking out of that is really foreign to them.
Speaker 1:So I think this is like as well, when we first started this process me and would have to ask ourselves where are they at? Are they even ready for us? Are they ready? And this is scary for us, because sometimes we can get drafted in to a place and some people want some of these things. The other people are even completely unaware that we've been drafted in to be able to glue it together. So then, when we do talk about these things, it's like a bit of an elephant in the room, because they're like, oh, bloody hell, I have to work with him, I have to communicate with him, I need him involved.
Speaker 1:And it's a bit like well, of course you do, but then there's kind of almost like oh OK, is this going to? Kind of work type attitude. So for us it's really important. It is tricky actually being involved with reliability.
Speaker 2:It's all under that change management and understanding how to. So you say change management.
Speaker 1:Yeah, a bit of a keyword there. What does it actually?
Speaker 2:mean so in terms of like change management. There's a, there's frameworks and topics and discussions that you can go through to assist in change right.
Speaker 1:So it's basically change. Management means changing the way things are done in terms of a management type of view in a way that is not disruptive.
Speaker 2:Yes and how to go about doing so and how to positively Approach change, because you know, a lot of people are quite naturally, I suppose human nature is like whoa, we're doing something different here.
Speaker 1:Yeah, like what does this mean for me.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so there's different ways of going about doing it. It's different education. I mean, like we focus very much on the educational side of things and not necessarily off the initial bat trying to like here's a three day training course, so like something that I'm now doing with one of our new customers that's going down. This roadmap is we're doing drop in sessions, so we're going in, we're there for a couple of days a month, separated out, and we've got, you know, some people we're doing like a morning session and afternoon session. Some people are coming in and they're kind of booked. They're like I guess I'm coming in on the morning but then everyone else is sent an internal communication to say, hey, there's a bit of time, just drop in, even if it's for 10, 15 minutes. If it's for longer, fantastic, and we're taking them through.
Speaker 2:That general awareness of this is reliability. This is the value and the benefit it has to the business. This is the value and benefit it has to you as an individual. This is what we're trying to achieve up for being a part of that.
Speaker 1:I love that, though, because you know why that, I think, is going to be so successful for us on the journey. It's not overload information. This is what we're doing, like whenever anything does change. You're right, human nature doesn't actually like it, and that we have to look into the psychology of why and whenever. Even us in our lives, if we're in a certain routine and all of a sudden, someone says, oh, I'm gonna change, like a safe example, you work for an organization like we obviously are kind of at the top of ours, but if we said to our guys, like, on Monday, we use a new analyzer, you need to do it this way. Here's kind of what we're doing. Regardless, that might be the right decision in the long term, but you don't introduce that change right now in that way, because it's gonna scare them, it's gonna scare everyone. So I think the beautiful thing is what we're trying to achieve is kind of just have the good conversations about why it is valuable, but do it by size and piece by piece.
Speaker 2:Don't rush it. You know, yeah, and it's gaining buying, do I believe, like we naturally know the benefit of it? Of course we know why it can really benefit an organiser.
Speaker 1:We can't be complacent in terms of, because we know that and we live, but we breathe it. We, like we dream about reliability, probably Do not be. It's so ingrained in us because it's something that we do every day. But we have to understand that when we are talking to other organisations, they have other things on their mind. They don't necessarily have that as their first thought to be able to be implemented.
Speaker 2:It doesn't have to be like some of the questions that come up in the MRT stuff, like within that cooperation type first stage. Number one does a maintenance manager exist? If he's not there, he's going to be, at least from an engineer, quite an important individual. And then, how does maintenance and operation cooperate? Do they discuss things with each other? You know, there's certain things in place and it may be that initially that those things are not being done. But what we have to do is start bridging those gaps to do and it doesn't mean that maintenance and operation need to be best friends, it just needs to be that they're self-aware of their own constraints and challenges.
Speaker 2:It's like we've recently done within our business, a disc workshop where we understand how everyone likes to be communicated with and I know how you like to be. Compared to how I like to be, and because we're so aware of that, we're actually a better team for it.
Speaker 1:Oh God, yeah, because now we understand why we are how we are.
Speaker 2:Yes, do you know what I mean?
Speaker 1:And I think, that's so important as well, because when you can understand how people are kind of wired to a degree because everyone is different and this is what I love about disc it really does hit the nail on the head as well, because when you do them workshops, and you understand that people's profiles, you're like, oh okay, well, that's why in that scenario, when we did have that chat, it kind of maybe went to that level or you know, this is why, kind of that was a reaction in that way, and you can really understand the psychology behind the reasons of why, and then you can start to actually ascertain well, that's just the way people are, which means that we need to be a little bit more aware of how we communicate with each other, rather than actually getting offended about reactions and all the rest of it and thinking that it's a personal thing, it's not like.
Speaker 1:This is the way people communicate. So, yeah, communication, I believe, and I think may anyone doing that disc profile it. You know that would be good to understand how to communicate with your. To be honest, it was a game changer for us anyway.
Speaker 1:Definitely. But it does tie into that whole communication with when we are communicating across even departments or within teams, and how we actually started to raise that awareness of what is valuable, right, and why is it valuable to your department, right, and why is it tied together. So that awareness piece is extremely important. First, just to display the benefits for each department of why reliability needs to be tied in, because until they know why.
Speaker 2:And there has to be that level of compromise and understanding that you know, let's say, a pump's failed, the lines shut down production. You know their concern is, you know we need to get the widgets out the door, like we need to get this line up and running as quickly as possible. That production side guy he's seeing like negative dollar signs in his eyes.
Speaker 1:It is because, remember, like a lot of production, kpis are based upon them that mention how many things are made.
Speaker 2:What he's doing is he's applying them pressure to the engineering department, saying you guys need to get this shit going and but he's got to have. There's issues at the moment in that that lies with. What ends up happening is with that pressurized environment because maybe that failure has happened unexpectedly is the engineering team then may start making mistakes. There's more likely to cause issues. They're rushing the job, they're trying to get it done. There's all this in place.
Speaker 1:And there's all that balance as well for production, between how many I actually achieve that, and quality as well. I mean, quality is a huge element as well.
Speaker 2:You have to have that level of understanding to kind of be able to initially and as further reliability improvements made. These random failures shouldn't happen. But when they do happen, there has to be a level of at least compromise where you know engineering might go back to product. Production might be like we need it back in an hour. Engineering might need to go back to potential. Look, we really need an hour and a half because we need to do some precision alignment on this before we do it and that may be said, yeah, fine, we understand the value as to exactly that we understand why we need to take a little bit more care and attention.
Speaker 1:I think that's where, if you know, we don't have a reliability understanding of why initially, so the whole culture chain needs to be based around. Why are we actually even trying to achieve?
Speaker 2:and it might not reliability, it might not even be, and you know, I don't know like I've been having an engineering background and everyone might be like, yeah, give engineering everything. But you know there are production constraints at times and it might be that it cannot be. We can't give you that extra half an hour right now. We really need to get this going. Can we just get this going as such? Then there then has to be the engineer from engineer and that says right, you are under considerable constraints, we will get this back together as best we can. But On the scheduled downtime on Saturday, we need a scheduled bit of downtime to come up to return to this within the next week when you can plan it in around your Current production. Again, that's communication isn't it.
Speaker 2:But that's because there's then an understanding on both parties.
Speaker 1:That's where we're at so inherently, that first part of that, that change in culture, is understanding the reasons why reliability is important for every and how that benefits each exactly the. So we've ascertained that. So, and our kind of responses kind of do these by size chunks, where we do these workshops, where we get people together and we start to explain the benefits and everything like that. What is the next stage of when people start to comprehend that and how do we kind of sustain that Idea when it hasn't been ingrained fully? So this is where the culture bit is not really important, because we now have to sustain, yeah, that reason I feel like with reliability.
Speaker 2:If it's not currently being measured, it should be. We have to measure how we perform the factory performs in terms of its reliability, but ultimately that metric is one that Can affect all the others within the organization. So if the plant has poor reliability, there's a good chance that the quality is going to dip, is a good chance that Down time is going to be high in productions, not going to be its optimum. Engineering is going to be getting pretty pissed off because they're to go in all over the place.
Speaker 1:Yeah, in a reactive way, yeah, in a reactive way.
Speaker 2:Excuse my language.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we'll zapped up today. I'm sorry. I think it's the first time I've actually had to bleep this. You'll have to bleep that Sorry. Terrible. It's passion, it's alright.
Speaker 2:I had a late night last night and I'm still. I'm just a bit buzzing from a coffee.
Speaker 2:So engineering are going to get frustrated because they go, that's the word, so they're going to go out and do repairs and everything like that, right, and so this reliability really does affect the whole organization and this isn't, you know, the way we see ourselves at maintain. I feel like any organization that supports reliability, anyone that I feel that goes in and says, yeah, we can do it all for you is is really selling a bit of a disservice in the sense that, ultimately, I think they're selling a bit of a dream that's a bit unachievable because, again, when we do look at having reliability, you need someone driving that and that's where we kind of position ourselves with this, which is that we are kind of the support, the training, the facilitator of all of this.
Speaker 2:We like the bridge.
Speaker 1:We like the bridge and be able to. And what we? What we do is say, right, we can, we can connect things together, but we kind of almost are like the playmaker in the middle.
Speaker 2:Yeah we can provide the, the templates, we can provide the train around how to utilize them, we can explain the importance behind it, we can provide the guidance around it and we can facilitate the meetings where we start doing criticality assessments and stuff like that.
Speaker 2:But you know that those things take time and we have to do bite-sized chunks and we do bits here and there in and around the business and organizations, resources and budget available. But if you're if you, if they want to see real future, sustainable success and a benefit to their organization and they want to improve reliability and they want to get better, then they need to invest in their people and they need to invest in have probably having someone with some more advanced reliability kind of training that can be that bridge between us the key reliability individual, and the organization so that ultimately, when we're not at site, it's still being driven forward, it's still being making improvements, we're still trying to look at how we do better at doing this and there is a period of time when it comes down with reactive maintenance and breaking out of that cycle, which is usually the onset of reliability, that ultimately there is a period of time where almost over resourcing has to kind of take place.
Speaker 1:It has to, though, doesn't it? Because if you think about that scenario and this is why it's so difficult to break out of, I believe, because when you are against it and you're spending money and just keeping things rolling, a lot of the time the idea of actually resourcing more to get out of it is just to a business is a difficult decision to do, different thing to difficult thing to justify. But you are right, because when you're in that cycle, how do you get out of it if you don't have the resource to be able to bring people in, like us in? It's a bit difficult as well, because it's all about focused attention. When you are in that cycle, you're just trying. It's a bit like survival mode, isn't it? You're just trying to get through, you're just trying to make sure that everything runs smoothly.
Speaker 1:So, in terms of reliability, it does require a lot of focus, and these elements even just providing master asset lists, making sure things are kind of labeled correctly and understanding what you've even got is quite a laborious, long task.
Speaker 1:It is to be able to go around and actually identify every single asset in a plant that has hundreds of assets, which some of our plants have a lot and a lot of the time. How many times do we come across a plant where you go there and you say well, what about this? And it's not even logged anywhere, it's not in the CMMS, hasn't got an asset code and it's probably quite important to the process. And this is the other thing as well about just identification of these assets. There is such a unneeded problem when something like that does fail and you've got no inclination that that asset's even existing on plant, because then you've got no spare. You don't understand the process of it in terms of how it and when it does fail, and then it gets you back into that reactivity again, because you're kind of walking around again trying to solve a problem where you was completely unaware it even existed. So this is the part of the issue and problem with this type of reactive cycle. Do you know what I mean?
Speaker 2:And that's why we like within that reliability culture piece. It is about building a bit of a committee or a team together. So it's me and you and maybe Joe the maintenance manager. And Joe the maintenance manager has seen that I don't know Bob, he's one of the engineers but Bob's really interested in reliability and he sees him as a potential guy that whilst he's an engineer on site and he's doing his job, he could be someone that's really interested in it.
Speaker 2:So what, we end up and then we get Fred, the production guy, involved and we build this bit of a team together where we've done some training with all the other members of the organization procurement. They're kind of a bit more on board, they understand what we're trying to do. But now we've got this little core team where we've got Fred from production. He knows his constraints. We've got the engineering manager, maintenance manager. He's there, he's involved with this, and then we've got an individual in the organization that's been kind of seeing as someone that's really interested in the reliability stuff, because that reliability individual is going to be focusing or wanting to support the organization much differently to what the maintenance manager is. They're kind of separate.
Speaker 1:Yeah, they are very separate, and I think this as well is what we've found, isn't it?
Speaker 1:We've found a lot of organizations have reliability engineers but then kind of they don't really know what their role is on site, and we've found that quite a lot. And it's great that they have allocated someone to be able to do the reliability element. But when we do have a look at kind of the framework that we try to deploy, we do go in and sometimes none of it's even really being deployed and they're looking at certain things about reliability for certain pieces of machinery but not really looking at the reason of why they're doing it in terms of that efficient framework. So I think this as well is really important as well, and it's great that we see these, these job titles and all the rest going around it, and it's great because even when we are introduced to that point, they have that resource, they're all ready to be able to implement it, but it just needs to be there, maybe directed in a way where we can offer them the ARP training, and that's so important that they do that training as well.
Speaker 2:They have to have a wise. There's no sustainability behind it. So you know, they've got to understand why isn't that? You know, once you've got that level of training and buying and awareness and that reliability, or that engineer that's particularly interested in what we're doing and he maybe does go on an ARP, the journey that is then set in course after that of continuing the culture change, continuing the the challenging within the business of you know, why have we just bought this really cheap motor or whatever that, once that piece is in motion and that is kind of continually being driven, ultimately culture change. It like, if we're attending the site for a couple of days per month, that culture change isn't going to happen. It like we can't just go we're all.
Speaker 2:It's like you're chipping away at a wall and just it's not enough impact for it to have a big effect but ultimately, when we start going down that journey of facilitating the likes of gathering documentation and master asset lists, starting criticality processes, starting maintenance strategy and writing maintenance plans, you know we come, come in and facilitate that process. We can help define the criticality in the right way that it should be done.
Speaker 1:But not even that. We can kind of have a look at that. What have you got? Look at the gaps that are kind of almost preventing this to happen. We don't want to rush this process. No one ever does, because I don't think it can be rushed. It needs to be something that it can be quicker in certain organizations with the right resource and the right mindset and the right mindset.
Speaker 1:But the problem is with this is the other thing as well. You might resource it, but without the right mindset, and where is it going to go? So it's a bit of a push and pull about understanding the awareness part, which is a little bit longer, and a lot of companies do want to go, go, go with this. I understand why, because the outcome is everyone wants to get to the outcome. Of course we do too as well. That's why we're here.
Speaker 1:But the idea is that push and pull between mindset and resource. But some companies may have the right mindset and just say, oh, we don't have the resources. That's okay, because what we can do is create a roadmap that suits that resource. It might take a little bit longer, or we can resource around it yeah, exactly, or we can be brought in as a part of that resource, to be able to fill in the gaps as well. We understand that. Or it might be the other case, where everyone wants to fund it and there wants to be a project done in a month. All the money's thrown at it, but it's like. Well, we need to make sure that everyone understands why this needs to happen first.
Speaker 2:And that's why we try to encourage that at least someone within the organization has kind of a more high level of training, and maybe not even one, but multiple people. So that it's important that once we do go through those processes of criticality assessments and stuff, that these are criticality of machine you may change, plant operations may change, and that once we go through this roadmap, ultimately, whilst we can still be there to facilitate it, where is the sustainability piece? If we were to step away and those people were not in the business, it wouldn't exist, and so yeah, I think that's as well.
Speaker 1:That's a question that you've got to ask yourself as well. So when you do implement something, what is the likelihood of it staying if you were to go? And that kind of then proves obviously how solid that implementation or operation within your organization, how sustainable is it? And you know how many times up we've seen it's a really good critical study done or really good plant asset management maps, but they've just been left and never updated. But then it's really difficult then because all of that good work that has been done almost needs to be done again. You can use some parts of it, but then usually it's the consistent update of that. But who's going to do that? Someone needs to be able to be tasked with them things on a consistent basis. And this all really does come down to one real core thing and that is consistency. Someone who does the little things really well Do you know what I mean?
Speaker 2:Don't have to be big tasks, but every day just works towards that and that is ultimately why having a member of the team that has a focus on reliability is a major and we are as well a bit of a push and a bit of an accountability to be able to do that Consistency. We are the accountability element.
Speaker 1:Because the thing is like why do people pay for fitness in general? You know, the fact is, you've got a garden, you can do push ups, you can do all the things. You can do calisthenics if you want to. You know what I mean. That's free. But the reason people pay to be able to go to a gym or do personal training is for accountability and the concerns aspect as well, isn't it?
Speaker 2:You've got someone there being there to do it, yeah, and not even that.
Speaker 1:How do you do it better, more efficiently and in the right way?
Speaker 2:And there's a team around you with all the same mindset and they're all trying to go on with all the things you can do, encouraging each other, and that's the thing.
Speaker 1:You know. I go to a monthly fitness thing and it's expensive. It is, and I don't even question something. I spend a lot of money here, but then I look at what actually gives me a value and I think I can't stop this now, because every single time I go to that place, I give 100%. I do it in a way that is the most efficient way.
Speaker 1:These guys are experts of how they do Right, but they're not even that. I don't even want to not turn on the next day and they're pushing you to do better, exactly so when again, I'm still there providing that for me every single day. It's a bit like the reliability stuff. You've got someone there who's doing that, but if you've got someone like us as the accountability and the you know, pushing them like we're not doing it for you, we can't work out for you, you've got to do that yourself. But we're there to make that accountable, give you the tools and the knowledge that you're going to be able to really get the results with and consistently do it to a point where you can almost do this yourself.
Speaker 2:I think that's such a great energy.
Speaker 1:It's great energy. Do you know what I just popped in the air today? You need to grab that little bit. I am going to grab that bit because, ultimately as well, it doesn't just apply to reliability, it applies to most things in life. Do you know what I mean? If we have to look at it, is it not? What is the cost of what we're doing here? We've got to look at the value, what it gives. Do you know what I mean?
Speaker 2:And that's why the conversation we had recently, which was that the push is to have that reliability, that key member of the team, not because of the fact that it needs to happen, but that is an investment in the business, yes, 100%.
Speaker 1:And it's a long-term one. I just feel like a lot of the time, we're looking at short-term metrics that don't really feed into the goals of where everyone wants to be eventually, and we've got to be more patient.
Speaker 2:Well, I just you know, yesterday I had that great meeting with one of the customers and they were sort of saying you know, we have got some training budget available and we want to get. You know, we want to invest in our people and I think it's really worth them going on an ARPA course. Amazing Six to eight people. Can we get them?
Speaker 1:But do you know what that will transform that into value?
Speaker 2:Yeah, because everyone again is now minds oh, I need to think about the way that I lubricate this motor. Oh, I need to think about the way I operate this.
Speaker 1:I know, and that's the thing with, like, anything that teaches you to change the way you see things has a profound impact on everything, like even in business, when I change the mindset of, like how I see the business working, everything from that point of four has changed the perception of everything that I do. And that, as well, is going to wrap this one up. So, guys, thank you for listening. Today We've obviously touched on culture and again we touched on mindset. We've touched on all of these great things. Next week, what are we going to touch on? Will Next stage?
Speaker 2:What's the next stage?
Speaker 1:Reliability strategy so now we get into strategy. I'm really excited for that conversation because I love a bit of strategy as well, so obviously, again, it all ties back to the mindset. But thank you for everyone that's tuning into this. It's been a great success this year. Everyone is commenting and yeah, this is the brand new kind of roadmap that we're going to be talking about, and everyone has a great week. So take care, take care guys.